Hi Duncan, I would guess that the gauge is correct. However, if the mark on the mast is from a different set of wires in the past then it is very unlikely the new set will measure the same, when pulled to the same mark, not only due to dyform or conventional but also whether they are exactly the same length. The mark on your mast will also differ depending on the genoa wire you are using. I personally always use the same luff wire with every Genoa (so my set-up remains consistent), but if you use different Genoas with different luff wires you would need separate marks for each Genoa 

I wouldn’t worry about sailing with 450-460 lbs of tension unless your boat is quite old. I regularly sail in the 450 – 500 lbs range when it is breezy. You can tell if you have too much tension in the system when the boat feels “twitchy” when sailing close-hauld in light winds. If you are struggling to find a nice grove in lighter breezes then easing the rig tension generally helps for me as it adds a little depth to the genoa. (a little off topic but thought i’d add)

Mike

Hi Peter,

That’s quite a lot of questions! All good ones though. I don’t want to say i’m a top sailor but I’ve won a few GP things so I’ll give answering your questions a go…

Following on from last year’s post about upwind technique, how do the top sailors sail downwind, and what am I missing out on?

Overall I think you maybe over-thinking some of it. I find good downwind boat speed needs really good boat handling first and foremost, where most of your maneuvers are performed from muscle memory rather than a conscious new thought (hope that makes sense). This takes lots of practice.

-Pop the downhaul, let the outhaul off maybe 2-3cm, ease the kicker till the top telltale flies 50% of the time. Usually leave the rig tension alone, as it’s difficult to get on properly again with the rig under load. How much do others adjust the rig tension between legs, if at all?

Kicker – I set to where looks sensible. Sometimes that it is probably with the tell-tale as you say but I never really take notice. I try to make a shape that looks sensible i.e. when looking for power something that looks like a plane wing on its end and when looking to dump power lots of twist (tell tale would then be flying all the time).

I never adjust rig tension from upwind to downwind. I only consider altering it when there is a significant change in wind pressure. (more when it windy, less when it is light)

I seldom release the outhaul on a GP. I just don’t think it makes that much difference when sailing inland, and the times I have released it I have generally forgotten to pull it on again upwind, which has more of a negative effect than the benefit of releasing it downwind. The exception is when I am doing a champs on the sea with long downwind legs, we generally then ease it on a broad reach when I looking for more power. I set it like an on-off button. Before the race we release the outhaul to where looks sensible and then put a stopper knot in the rope, so when we round the windward mark we just release it to the knot and forget about trimming it to the mm.

Downhaul is always fully released unless it is a windy 2 sail reach then it is maybe pulled on hard or if it is a windy 3 sail reach and I need to twist the mainsail off to de-power and gain some height.

-Board half up on a reach, 3/4 up on a run.

Roughly yes, but I constantly re-adjust the board to where the balance feels right. On a windy reach the board can be as far up as 3/4. I am also re-adjusting a lot on the run depending on whether I am heading dead downwind (up as much as I dare), or down a bit if my VMG would be better sailing higher. On a long run I maybe swapping between the two a lot depending on the differences in pressure.

-Keep the boat flat, if necessary by dumping the main (but mainly just by hiking harder). Jib set to the telltales. Is this likely to choke the slot and slow me down excessively? Is this how other people control heel? Or would you dump the jib or spinnaker first to stop the slot getting choked?

I assume you mean breezy reaching conditions, otherwise you would want all sails pulling as hard as possible, therefore aiming for perfect boat and sail trim. When it is breezy, the most common mistake I see (and do) is when you get too focused on the mark early in the reach and forget about trim and speed. The boat’s angle may change a lot on a reach in breezy conditions, generally bear away in gusts and head up in lulls. For example, when a gust hits you may need to do a sharp bear-away to balance the boat whilst also moving back in the boat, hiking out and trimming sails; the boat will then accelerate quickly and then you will find it is easier to harden up towards your intended direction. It is crucial when breezy on a reach to have the kite at maximum eased position (the odd flap is better than over sheeting). The jib tell-tales should be flying but if struggling for height then a little luffing is acceptable. Over sheeting is a big no and can cause a capsize. Main will be constantly changing trim to reflect the course of the boat and how much power you need. If you are really overpowered, ease kicker a little and pull on downhaul. This will allow you to sheet slighter further inboard as the sail will twist more higher up and keep the slot open for the kite to drive you forwards.

-Trim-wise, I try and keep the angle of the bow skimming the water in non-planing conditions, which generally means sitting quite far forwards. Usually I will sit on the thwart in line with the sidestay, to leeward, while my crew sits level with me to windward.

I don’t think about the bow skimming the water. When not planing I just try and maximise the waterline length (which tends to be a similar position to for-aft upwind position). When very light we will probably induce a little heal to reduce wet area but keeping the same waterline length. When planing I just move aft based on feel. I find most boats in breezy conditions on a reach don’t sit far enough aft and then when it goes light forget to move forwards, quickly enough (I am particularly guilty of the latter point, which I am working on…).

-The guy is set so as to be far enough forward that the spinnaker doesn’t touch the forestay when sheeted in enough to stop the luff from curling.

Correct. Careful that the pole will bend further in breezy conditions.

-The pole height is set so the luff of the spinnaker curls roughly half-way up when it breaks. If it curls too high, pole goes up, too low and the pole goes down.

I think if it curls too high the pole needs to come down and vice versa. As a general rule my pole cuts across the genea at a perpendicular angle to the luff (I think that is the best way to describe it), and we generally just lower the pole it when it goes light to help the kite fill.

-Tactically, I tend to sail pretty high away from the windward or gybe mark to get clear breeze, and then come down into the next mark with speed. If I’m going to go low I do it early, and only if I’m caught on the inside of a bunch at the windward, or outside at the gybe. Is this the right thing to do?

I’m probably fairly similar to that but things change depending on position in fleet, conditions, tide ,how tight the reach is etc… If it is a standard reach (i.e. not too broad), and planing conditions I will generally if not in the lead delay my kite hoist, find a clear lane above the pack, pop the kite and try to overtake as many boats as possible in clear wind. Tactically though, you need to think about whether you are in an attacking or defending position and then adjust accordingly. Going low would probably be a bad choice if you are just ahead of a pack  who could cover all your wind (i.e. defending position), but as you say if you are at the back of a pack you can be in an attacking position and have the choice of sailing the shortest distance,  sailing low (good strategy if you round the windward mark in lots of breeze) or high (if you round the windward mark in little breezy and the new breeze is going to fill up higher).

-Perhaps most importantly, technique. In light and patchy winds, I point up about 10 degrees from the rhumb line in the lulls, and bear about 10 degrees below it in the gusts, rolling the boat maybe 5-10 degrees to facilitate steering and minimise rudder drag. Does anybody else do this? Do you find the advantage of staying in pressure longer makes up for the extra distance sailed?

See above, it is about trying to make a decision of what will maximise your VMG in relation to the point you want to get to. see – http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Velocity_made_good 

Anything you can do to minimise rudder drag is good but careful not to be too aggressive as there will come a point where too much heal will have bigger negative affect than what moving the rudder would have done.

In planing conditions, I tend to point up slightly when the boat isn’t planing, again by using about 5-10 degrees of roll, which allows me a roll to get the boat flat again as I pump the main and lean forwards as the wave passes under the mast and the bow dips. Once she starts to surf, my crew and I get our weight as far back as possible, sheet in the sails to stop them collapsing due to the apparent wind, and I steer the boat to keep pace with the wave, basically if the boat is going much quicker than the wave, I point slightly higher so the boat doesn’t overtake the wave and drop off the plane. Is this the correct technique, or can anybody recommend how I can improve it? I find my biggest losses happen in marginal planing conditions, when I am slightly slower to get on the plane than others around me.

My simple rule I sail to is to try and keep the boat pointing downhill (easier said than done though). Sometimes that means bearing away rather than pointing up to prevent smashing in to the wave in front, whilst also considering where the next gust is and progress towards the mark. In marginal conditions our weight is moving all the time (hopefully in a smooth fashion) fore and after, in and out to ensure balance.

Finally, are there any good videos of all this being done right? It would be good to have a close look at somebody who knows what they’re doing, even better if there is coach commentary on them (doesn’t even particularly have to be a GP, although that would help!), and are there any good downwind training exercises people could share to help improve?

Check out:

GP open from Poole prior to Looe Worlds

Merlin Nationals (Looe. 14 mins 6 secs to see an example of how Stu Bithell sent it down a windy reach)

Mike

That’s interesting, I was always taught that you should adjust your boat balance so the rudder always felt “slack” to reduce turbulence, so pointing up always gets combined with a slight leeward roll so there’s no resistance when I move the tiller away. I also find in light winds that rolling the boat to facilitate steering means that I can get an extra spurt of power when I flatten it out again afterwards (although this is straying into debatable rule 42 territory). Perhaps this is more effective in a boat that’s more sensitive to weight movement, like a mirror or a firefly? Anyway, you reckon the possible extra leeway and loss in power in a GP cancels out any benefit from minimising rudder drag? – Unfortunately I don’t there is one rule for all conditions. I usually sail on a small pond so the lifts and headers can be extreme from 1 minute to the next. To actively induce leeward heal to role the boat to windward would mean the lift would have to be substantial. In any breeze where the helm and crew are sitting to windward I would argue that letting the boat heal to leeward would negatively effect your sideways drift compared to sailing flat and fast. I am also not conscious of my rudder movement in this scenario. If the lift was substantial which required lots of rudder movement, I would expect the wind to be light, so in this scenario I probably would naturally move my bum from the deck to the inside seat which I would of thought naturally made my rudder lift the boat up. I’m not 100% sure about this as this action isn’t something I think about. It is just a muscle memory.

So when you’re steering the boat through waves, you just keep the jib fully in? I think my crews will be happy to hear that! – Yes, however if there is a wave that is particularly steep or I cock it up, we may ease the genoa on the back side of the wave for a few seconds then put the bow down to get some speed back up. Generally though, I will sail the boat in a “high mode” up the wave (max power, maybe slightly pinched, windward jib tell tale fluttering up), and “low mode” down the wave (efficient sail plan, tell tales streaming). That could mean in any decent wind the mainsail is slightly over sheeted going up the wave and eased back to its fast position down the wave. In light to moderate conditions where the main is never eased it is all about generating max power, so little kicker but loads of mainsheet tension as this will bend the mast much less than kicker and therefore give you a more powerful sail. The main in these conditions will remain relatively static, but the waves should also be smaller given the conditions. Rudder movement will be lots more in short steep waves than long rolling ones, but assuming you have correct trim, you shouldn’t generally need to ease the jib very often. If you do, just make sure you remember to get it back as soon as you are back to speed.

So you think that the difference is small enough that boat-to-boat tactics are the main factor in your decision? – Generally, yes. My perfect race is simply to go the same way as everyone else, but faster. Minimises the risk. However, if I find myself back in the fleet I will take any little gain I can find to pick my way up. Generally though small shifts don’t make the biggest difference in this scenario, but boat handling around marks. If you mess up your mark rounding it then generally means you have next to no options on your next leg. A good mark rounding gives you a left/right decision or high/low decision to make. A bad rounding means you have to go one or the other to get a good lane, which could be the wrong decision. After that and assuming you have good boat speed, most of my thoughts are then on boat-boat tactics relative to the fleet. My biggest decisions tactically are generally taken in the 2-3 minutes prior to the start as that will determine whether we go middle-left or middle-right up the first beat. If we get round the first mark in the top few, then it is generally just close boat tactics that remain, unless the fleet I am concerned with split tacks, then the decision making process is based on my interpretation of the best way to go, or where my likely regatta competition is relative to the risks I am taking.

Sheeting angles are always a problem for me. Do you usually use leach hook at spreader height as an indication? Or is there another method you use? I’ve heard of using the angle the jib sheet makes with the clew as a method, but it seems like that would vary with the actual cut of the sail, so it’s not something I want to rely on too much – I try to get the sheeting angle to be about 45 to 60 degrees (ish). I have never measured it but it looks as though the angle would probably split the jib in two if you continued the line. I very rarely alter it. In fact on a previous boat I fitted it out without any adjustment. A GP genoa is a flat sail compared to a lot of other boats because it is sheeted so far outboard (on the side deck). Therefore the most critical control after you have got the angle about right is how hard you pull it. I would recommend, next time you look at replacing your mainsail you ask your sailmaker to put a spreader window in (if you don’t have one) as you can then see when sitting to windward whether the genoa is pulled in hard enough or not. Generally above a force 1 it is pulled in tight, but the window is useful as generally it is not pulled in tight enough when the breeze pipes up.

I think I get you. So if you’re sailing in non-tidal waters, with oscillating shifts, and there’s a big black cloud on the left hand side (or even if it just looks like there’s a bit more breeze on the way down the left), you want to try and keep to the left of the fleet even if it means initially taking a knock from the shifts? Basically ride the lift all the way round the right hand side of the breeze – Yes, these decisions are generally made right at the beginning of the beat, ideally pre-start or just before you drop your kite at the leeward mark, as it can have a big impact on how you start or mark round.

Mike

Hi Norman,

Assuming your wire is 3mm in diameter, I think 400lbs is just under mark “28”.

– image from flying fifteen site.

hope this helps.

Mike

Hi Paraic,

My interpretation of the difference between MKI, MKII & MKIII is mainly about the internal layouts. I am unaware of any hull shape rule changes between the different models. The rules as they exist already allow for minor tolerances in hull shape so not all GPs will be exactly the same.

The MKI has a single floor, with floor boards attached on top. Buoyancy aft of the fore tank is provided with inflatable bags. The floor is generally a bit lower than MKII & MKIIIs and therefore a little more comfortable as your knees are less bent. I am not aware of any MKIs built solely for racing for a long time, however many are still competitive. I am actually sailing one tomorrow at the club.

The MKII has a double skin floor. There is extra bouyancy in the floor and therefore no need for buoyancy bags. You will probably find the layout of a MKII more simple than a MKI. They also tend to take on much less water if you capsize. The MKII will have 2 central bailers, either side of the centreboard casing.

The MKIII is as per the MKII but with no self-bailers. This is achieved by raising the floor a little more and in the case of duffin hulls adding two slots into the centreboard case (above the water line) which self bails the water. I am unsure whether the new Winders have these slots or if they have managed to design it in such a way so any water goes out of the transom.

If your after some pointers about what is fast internationally, the top 3 results of the most recent World Championship and UK National Championships were shared between Duffin (wood), Winder (plastic) and Boon (plastic). I have sailed all three and can say they are all extremely quick and very well made.

Hope this helps.

Mike

Hi Colin,

I have added the class rules to the members library. Thanks for spotting this. We are still going through the process of transferring some things over, so if you do spot anything please continue to post on the forum.

Ref: Results – I could simply copy the results bit from the old website, but have thoughts to provide something cooler. The original results archive on the old website was a manual page, meaning they had to be individually loaded and linked to that website which relied on someone to do it, which inevitably means the archive will never include all results. I actually didn’t realise that page existed on the old site until your post!! However, we have been discussing about a better way to archive results when an event report is loaded and I am exploring how easy it would be convert all future results into a pdf file when received in html or sailwave format and then categorising those attachments as “results”. This will allow us to create a results archive which will automatically pick up these pdf files and display them in a user friendly way without anyone doing any more work than what an event report requires.

I will pop up a news article to alert everyone when this is live. In the meantime I will look at simply copying the results from the old website and displaying in a similar format.

Cheers, Mike